Custom T.S. T4 Manifold and front end

[dsm-onster]

You weld better than me!

But talk about giving up "easy flow" for even length. I am not knocking your manifold at all! But you've got some massive angles there! On just one runner. Now, for the record, such turning of the flow doesn't matter if the flow ends up balanced in the end. However, everyone tends to build evenly for the sake of anticipated balance. That's why I built a top mount manifold; it was easier to get about the same turns per leg. I'm not convinced it even matters though. So just take my notation as a "side note".

Regardless, you'll not have much issue with reversion with insuring even length for each runner. And again, you're welds are nice

 

[SlowChild3]

Glad you chose to tig weld it. Having stalagmites inside your manifold from shootin gaps with mig is scary to think about.

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[viperlp01]

You weld better than me!

But talk about giving up "easy flow" for even length. I am not knocking your manifold at all! But you've got some massive angles there! On just one runner. Now, for the record, such turning of the flow doesn't matter if the flow ends up balanced in the end. However, everyone tends to build evenly for the sake of anticipated balance. That's why I built a top mount manifold; it was easier to get about the same turns per leg. I'm not convinced it even matters though. So just take my notation as a "side note".

Regardless, you'll not have much issue with reversion with insuring even length for each runner. And again, you're welds are nice

Ya it was thought about but honestly it was either 18 inches or about 6 inches so I had to match them up. Not one "tight" radius bend was used. I used all 90* bends and straights and just cut as I needed. Runner 1 is 18in, runner 2 is 17, runner 3 is 20, and runner four is 16in(rough)

 

[cody92talon]

Helium helps for thick aluminum. Let's it flow better and better penetration. Regardless you won't get a good clean weld with a material constantly soaked with oil. I've always seen the welded bungs but has no one tried tapping?

i just tapped the VC and put fittings in mine. we'll see how it works wen i get the done and up and running.

the manifold is looking create! im a welder for a living and im hoping to make an attempt at my own top mount manifold sometime. but i was wondering how your going to get at some of those welds near the collector with the manifold being so tight??

second just curious what are you going to do for a front motor mount?

 

[viperlp01]

No front motor mount, prothane side mounts and solid rear mount. I am going to weld as much as I can and then break off the collector to get as some of the tight spots. I really don't know how I am going to get into the tight areas.. Hang the tungsten wayyy out there

 

[SlowChild3]

You can also heat the tungsten and bend it.

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[99gst_racer]

Can't wait to see this thing all TIG'd up with a pair of gates and a turbo hanging off of it.

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[cody92talon]

it might be easiest to try and break the manifold at a section in the middle of each runner where you can easily reach to weld and then weld all your joints then put it back together and weld those easy joints. just my $0.02

 

[viperlp01]

Warpage is the main factor. Just tacking the manifold up, for example, you can feel the metal move in your hands. I think the key is some well placed tacks to prevent major warpage. Going to to local welding store to pick up filler metal and fill my CO2 tanks(I left both of them on over night and they leaked bone dry.)

 

[SlowChild3]

Ya, your tubes with the gaps are going to pull real hard. If you do break at the collector check alignment. Start and stop on the side you want to pull it to.

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[DashLaflash]

Is there anyway you can weigh the metal you cut out of the car? I'm curious how much the frame rails and stuff weigh. Also what gauge steel did you use to box in the frame rails?

 

[fatt6903]

Nice work bro ive been following since you started. Im intrested in how you fab the front end up the most, Im still kicking the ball around as to how Im going to do mine. Arent you worried that the bar you installed has no stoping power at the angel you put it on? IMO you hit a wall at 75+mph that bar will fold up on you. Nothing but nice things to say about the manifold, 2+ cant wait to see it with gates and a turbo on it

 

[black_gst]

Nice work bro ive been following since you started. Im intrested in how you fab the front end up the most, Im still kicking the ball around as to how Im going to do mine. Arent you worried that the bar you installed has no stoping power at the angel you put it on? IMO you hit a wall at 75+mph that bar will fold up on you. Nothing but nice things to say about the manifold, 2+ cant wait to see it with gates and a turbo on it

hitting a wall at 75+ mph in any car isn't going to end well. That bar isn't there to be a crash bumper.

 

[viperlp01]

hitting a wall at 75+ mph in any car isn't going to end well. That bar isn't there to be a crash bumper.

Exactly. When you remove the front crash bar the metal that is now stopping a front end collision is a joke. I knew that I could not make the front end crash "resistant". This is not a drive everyday car. When its nice out and at the track.

I think I weighed the front out to about 36 lbs. I cut up the piece I took off the next day for a customers rusty core support. But the weight is not the main reason I did it. I wanted my turbo where it sits and it was impossible with the engine bay we were given, so I improvised.

I used 11ga to box in the rails.

 

[fatt6903]

hitting a wall at 75+ mph in any car isn't going to end well. That bar isn't there to be a crash bumper.

Clearly you havent seen too many drag cars hit the wall at speed.
Im just asking for your saftey I wouldnt want a fellow dsm'r hurt or dead in a crazy crash at the track. Just lookin out

 

[fatt6903]

Any updates????

 

[viperlp01]

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Been super busy. I got a 99 GSX at the shop that pretty much is doing a complete rebuild from engine back that I have been working on. I am going to weld some more tomorrow and hopefully get most of the runners welded up

 

[99gst_racer]

Looks good so far, man.


How's Sewey's car coming along?

 

[turboglenn]

Looking pretty good man!! Yoiu definitely have a few tight places to get to on that build for sure. One thing you find out on your first couple manifold builds is that more time will be put into the the planning and execution of the welds and build order than anything else.

I try and have everything setup where there's no more than 2-3 seperate parts that get their welds done up and then weld them together afterwards. Usually just collector area and main flange area done seperate and then assembled.

Are you back-gassing those? Somethign i've come to love more than back-gas/purging is to get a can of "Solarflux-B" (pipefitter's use this stuff like crazy) YOu mix some powder with methanol (heet) and apply it to the back of both sides of the joint about an inch or more long, and just like flux when you get it hot it cooks off and evacuates any oxygen from the area.. At 60 bucks a pint for the powder it seems pricey untill you realize how much argon it saves you and how nice of results it leaves you with (you can get it at about any welding supply shop)

Keep the updates coming in!!! (i'm the most interested in your tubular front end - i'm really wanting to chop the front off my DD and tube it out just to clean it up and make more room for the odds and ends )

Also... what do you plan to do about warpage on the main head flange? I use an old head i have and bolt everything down to it when i do those welds... one thing I've found important is to torque the bolts all the same if possible and use large washers or nuts with the largest possible "Flange" on them that i can fit to try and keep warpage minimal. (not sure the washers help but i always do em anyway) the torqueing i have seen help a lot. even if they are all at only 10ft/lbs it keeps things evenly stressed and the warpage will be consistant across the entire flange from the one added step... Then i usually have to either lap the thing on a piece of granite or steel with sandpaper glued to it to get the final finish, or now days with my new mill i can setup most things this size for a surfacing cut

 

[viperlp01]

I am borrowing a purging jig to fill the runners. Seweys car is coming.. Most the suspension is on and the engine is ripped down waiting on rings. Should get it mostly back together tomorrow. But I am tired.. Back to the shop tomorrow.

 

[99gst_racer]

Are you back-gassing those? Somethign i've come to love more than back-gas/purging is to get a can of "Solarflux-B" (pipefitter's use this stuff like crazy) YOu mix some powder with methanol (heet) and apply it to the back of both sides of the joint about an inch or more long, and just like flux when you get it hot it cooks off and evacuates any oxygen from the area.. At 60 bucks a pint for the powder it seems pricey untill you realize how much argon it saves you and how nice of results it leaves you with (you can get it at about any welding supply shop)

You like solar flux better than backpurging? Seems like it would be far more difficult to use solarflux on a header build like this. I assume it would need to be applied to the inner joint before fitting and tacking?

Also... what do you plan to do about warpage on the main head flange? I use an old head i have and bolt everything down to it when i do those welds...

Same here.

John also has a nice big surfacer, so he can clean up the flange face if it warps any at all.

 

[turboglenn]

I am borrowing a purging jig to fill the runners. Seweys car is coming.. Most the suspension is on and the engine is ripped down waiting on rings. Should get it mostly back together tomorrow. But I am tired.. Back to the shop tomorrow.

If for no other reason that how agrivating it is to have the bottle run dead from the back-purging, i'd say give the solarflux a try it's great. I bought it just to have for those "just in case" moments and since trying it i will not back-gas unless i have a really strong reason not to use flux

You like solar flux better than backpurging? Seems like it would be far more difficult to use solarflux on a header build like this. I assume it would need to be applied to the inner joint before fitting and tacking?

Yea, you do need to plan it's use in the early stages, But as long as you have it when tacking and stuff it's so much nicer come time to seam everything up.

On header builds with typical weld els, i just apply it all over the insides of the pieces when it's tacking time. You won't burn off an amount worth worrying about during tacking so it stays in place and even after a week of handling and fitting as long as you don't physically rub it off it will still be nicely coating the pieces inside it will be there when you're ready

MY favorite thing about it is it goes so far that it's actually well worththe 60 bucks the can costs up front. I mix it up on my welding table (which now is just a piece of 2 x 3 foot SS plate) I just pour a little poder out, then drop a little heet on it and mix and apply it with a toothbrush. And when its all dried you can re-wet it to keep using or just scrape the remaining dried up powder back in the container for another day. Originally i thought "this won't protect as good as argon pouring in"... but it really does the sugaring is just as minimal and sometimes better depending on how sealed up your gassin rig is.

John also has a nice big surfacer, so he can clean up the flange face if it warps any at all.

MMMMMMMMMmmmmmmmmm... ToolS!!!!!!!! Gotta love em, having the right tool for the job is well worth its cost even when you only use it here and there, I never regret tool purchases

 

[fatt6903]

How long have you been tig welding? Those welds dont look perfect but they will work. Have to looked into Weldingtipsandtricks.com that guy has alot of good info on his site. Im not knocking on them they look better than my tig welds at this point.

 

[viperlp01]

Ya I will need to put a new belt on to resurface the stainless. The shit is so hard. I have been tig welding since January of this year. I took a tig class at school(while trying to fit in my core classes for engin. major )

Paul- The filler rod needed is 1/16 and 1/8. 1/16 for the runners and 1/8 for the head flange. I bought WAYYY to much 1/8.. If anyone wants some 347 1/8 filler rod I have like 5 lbs of it and need to sell some to get some money back. In the mean time I am using 316 filler on the runners.

You can without a doubt see where I started. I forgot to bring 2 pieces so I can practice so I just started welding all the under sides of the welds and those look shitty. As I was moving along on the joints they started looking alot better. The heat was the hardest part to get right. Good penetration but also not burning all the chromium out of the base.

I will hopefully have more time to work on it tonight.

 

[sparky1987]

Try 4043 its what I use and it seems to work perfect on 6061 and 3003 series aluminum and many others