Borg Warner EFR Turbo, On A DSM Yet, What About the V Band DP?

[We're on Boost]

I will be receiving the 1.05 A/R TS EFR7670 from Full Race.
Bottom mount divided T4 JMF exhaust manifold with a custom JMF O2 eliminator downpipe.

Chris could you elaborate on this a bit?
Will JMF have to have your turbo in their shop to build this custom stuff?
Is the manifold also custom? I don't see it in their catalog.

 

[Strm Trpr]

Will JMF have to have your turbo in their shop to build this custom stuff?
Is the manifold also custom? I don't see it in their catalog.

When I contacted Jim about building a divided T3 manifold for a HX35 he requested that I send in the turbo so he could guarantee fitment.
He asked me to measure the HX35 comp cover and they're almost 8" in diameter.
Jim mentioned that his divided T3 manifolds were designed around the Garrett S comp cover.

I don't think this EFR7670 will be much different.
At the very least I'd send Jim the turbine housing so he can do the manifold and O2 eliminator downpipe work.

Here's a quote from Paul, 99gst_racer from a thread he started over on DSMTalk a few years ago.

Here's the thread.
New T4 Manifold - JHRacing - DSM Forums: Mitsubishi Eclipse, Plymouth Laser, and Eagle Talon Forum: DSMtalk.com

This manifold just became available to the market within the past 6 weeks or so. I figured I'd show it off a bit in case someone else is in the market for one.

It's a bottom mount true-divided T4. Twin-gated, forged stainless construction, .109" wall thickness tubing, etc....

This thing is awesome. Fit's like a glove and the craftsmanship is superb.

For more info, check out Jake's website: http://www.jhracing.net/Twin_Scroll_T4.html

These are also on sale right now at $200 off of the normal retail price!

PICS:

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Unfortunately Jake's site is down, and I've contacted Paul asking if he knew how to get a hold of Jake, and word around the campfire is Jake is no longer making these.
Bummer too, cause these manifolds are top notch!

On another note, I hope that by usng 1.25" ID tubing Jim will be able to make the manifold slightly more compact.

For now I'm modifying the 2g Fluidyne radiator and moving inlet tube location over to the passenger side like a 1g radiator.

We'll see what Jim says about the EFR7670 once I have it in my hands, and I can measure it.
http://www.turbodriven.com/files/pdf/179392-EFRTechPages.pdf

 

[Car Cannibal]

Cool, keep us posted on that DP from JMF, that's going to be DSM universal for everyone going the BW EFR route.

Keep in mind that the T4 TS .92 is internally gated and the 1.05 housing is externally gated. BW shows the .92 as a $150 extra and external will be more since you have JMF needing to add the WG tubing (?$) and flange ($20), the wastegate ($225) itself and then the dump tube ($20).

Depends on your E.T. goals, but I'm not sure the gain in .13 in ex housing on the small 76/70 really warrants the expense vs the internal gate.

 

[Strm Trpr]

Cool, keep us posted on that DP from JMF, that's going to be DSM universal for everyone going the BW EFR route.

Keep in mind that the T4 TS .92 is internally gated and the 1.05 housing is externally gated. BW shows the .92 as a $150 extra and external will be more since you have JMF needing to add the WG tubing (?$) and flange ($20), the wastegate ($225) itself and then the dump tube ($20).

Depends on your E.T. goals, but I'm not sure the gain in .13 in ex housing on the small 76/70 really warrants the expense vs the internal gate.

I hear what you're saying.
I'm no drag racer by any means.
I just do track days and there is a local road racing group called Northern California Racing Club that has a circuit for TT, so I'll start there.

I do not doubt the internal .92 A/R T4 set-up would work, but it is a really long turbo.
Flange to flange, the .92 A/R T4 set-up is 1.56" longer than the nonwastegated version.
The exhaust nozzle is much longer, and the compressor inlet is much longer due to the integrated CBV.
Full-Race only recommends the externally gated EFR's for Evo's due to fitment issues with the internally gated EFR's.

This is my one shot to do it right the first time.
And, if need be I can always get a 8374 if the 7670 isn't big enough, but I bet it will be and then some!

 

[We're on Boost]

At the very least I'd send Jim the turbine housing so he can do the manifold and O2 eliminator downpipe work .....

Yeah I think you'll have to send him the turbine housing at the least.
From the pics Geoff has shown I was worried about the turbine outlet being so long, plus the 3" pipe diameter needed at the outlet which makes that first bend a doosey which takes up a lot of room if you are having an actual mandrel bend there, as opposed to like a clam shell or a doughnut section or something.
But the picture they show on the turbodriven page that you posted a link to, that outlet doesn't look ridiculous long like the other ones do.

Anyway, if Jim has your turbine housing in hand before he even starts building your manifold, he could build the manifold so there is room for a reasonable pipe at your turbine outlet.


The T3 "Hot Parts kits" that Shearer builds for DSM single scroll all use a 2.5" diameter pipe at the turbine outlet, and he is figuring you are going to use a GT35 size turbo. He does this to make it compact, and he says that a proper mandrel bend in 2.5" pipe will flow as well or better than a crappy bend in 3" pipe. You, I'm sure, will have to use approx 3" pipe there just because the turbine housing is made that way. What I am saying is Jim will have to get it all done right for you.

Shearer makes 2 different T4 divided manifolds for DSM. The one he calls the "Gen 2" would probably be real nice, but I think he is figuring a big turbo like a GT42, and he says "alternator relocation is highly recommended". The other one is a front-facing.

I think you are doing right with the small diameter runners idea. I know Geoff is a big fan of small runners, to keep the exhaust velocity up, between the head and the turbo. I don't know what diameter he uses but I know he likes it small. Also, Shearer's newest DSM manifold (for single scroll) is the "small tube" manifold which he says is good to 700 hp and gives wonderful spool and midrange. If I was buying stuff for a new single scroll setup right now that's what I would buy.

Anyway, sounds like you have it covered. Just thought I'd put in my .02 in case it is helpful anywhere.

Oh yeah, the 1g style radiator sounds good, always wonder why they made the 2g radiator like that!

 

[gsx4g64]

When I contacted Jim about building a divided T3 manifold for a HX35 he requested that I send in the turbo so he could guarantee fitment.
He asked me to measure the HX35 comp cover and they're almost 8" in diameter.
Jim mentioned that his divided T3 manifolds were designed around the Garrett S comp cover.

I don't think this EFR7670 will be much different.
At the very least I'd send Jim the turbine housing so he can do the manifold and O2 eliminator downpipe work.

Here's a quote from Paul, 99gst_racer from a thread he started over on DSMTalk a few years ago.

Here's the thread.
New T4 Manifold - JHRacing - DSM Forums: Mitsubishi Eclipse, Plymouth Laser, and Eagle Talon Forum: DSMtalk.com



Unfortunately Jake's site is down, and I've contacted Paul asking if he knew how to get a hold of Jake, and word around the campfire is Jake is no longer making these.
Bummer too, cause these manifolds are top notch!

On another note, I hope that by usng 1.25" ID tubing Jim will be able to make the manifold slightly more compact.

For now I'm modifying the 2g Fluidyne radiator and moving inlet tube location over to the passenger side like a 1g radiator.

We'll see what Jim says about the EFR7670 once I have it in my hands, and I can measure it.
http://www.turbodriven.com/files/pdf/179392-EFRTechPages.pdf

I happen to know Jake. I thought that I would take the time to let you guys know that xyz takes place that it will be possible to get these manifolds. He may be making them in small batches. The manifolds will be of the same quality, and design.

He does have a top mount design that would be great for this turbo, as the top mount manifolds are not gated.

 

[twicks69]

*EDIT* Link to above posted statement:


http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/bolt-tech/390102-jhracing-twin-scroll-manifolds-may-back.html

 

[Strm Trpr]

IIRC, Jake's divided T4 bottom mount manifolds were $699 w/out provisions for gates...

Do I get a discount if I got it right...

 

[gsx4g64]

IIRC, Jake's divided T4 bottom mount manifolds were $699 w/out provisions for gates...

Do I get a discount if I got it right...

smiling. We will have to check with Jake.

 

[Slippi84]

I just saw an ad for the Borg warner efr turbos in dsport and thought I would read up on them. Two things that will stearbme away and have always done so with $2k turbos. One and foremost the cost. I don't think any turbo is worth that much. Hell.my shell cost that much and it has a cage. Two most turbos this much are full ball bearing and aren't refundable and you know the say "racing is breaking". Last while those numbers look good a s400sx with the right mode will make this power and only set you back about a grand. Great turbo and design but like 3d tv's ill wait till they come down in price.

 

[cyclonekid77]

I just saw an ad for the Borg warner efr turbos in dsport and thought I would read up on them. Two things that will stearbme away and have always done so with $2k turbos. One and foremost the cost. I don't think any turbo is worth that much. Hell.my shell cost that much and it has a cage. Two most turbos this much are full ball bearing and aren't refundable and you know the say "racing is breaking". Last while those numbers look good a s400sx with the right mode will make this power and only set you back about a grand. Great turbo and design but like 3d tv's ill wait till they come down in price.

Your not figuring in what you get with the efr for 2 grand. Its basically a turbo, wastegate, boost control solenoid and bov all in one package. The s400sx is a grand, and you still have to buy all that stuff separate so if you do save anything, it wont be much.

 

[donniekak]

Your not figuring in what you get with the efr for 2 grand. Its basically a turbo, wastegate, boost control solenoid and bov all in one package. The s400sx is a grand, and you still have to buy all that stuff separate so if you do save anything, it wont be much.

The thing is, most people in the market for this turbo, already have all those parts.

 

[Car Cannibal]

Keep in mind that everything on the EFR is an updated design, housings, wheels, bov and wastegate function vs turbos that everyone else makes exactly the same way.

And the prices came down, saw a post that was mid-high 1000's now vs low 2000's.

But if no one creates the 3" V Band DP for them on our platform, it's not worth talking about.

 

[Slippi84]

Your not figuring in what you get with the efr for 2 grand. Its basically a turbo, wastegate, boost control solenoid and bov all in one package. The s400sx is a grand, and you still have to buy all that stuff separate so if you do save anything, it wont be much.

The turbo I would get would be a the 91-80 and anyone buying a 1000hp turbo one prob has all that stuff and two has the ability or resources to get a dp made. Also most guys going that big use 3" ic piping not 2.5 like this cover is set up for. Ett Borg turbos with pro wheel isn't far off from these numbers either. I was hoping to see something built in like the quick spool valve to the actual turbo

 

[Strm Trpr]

But if no one creates the 3" V Band DP for them on our platform, it's not worth talking about.

I have yet to receive my EFR7670, but when I do, it'll be shipped to JMF for a divided T4 manifold and an O2 eliminator 3" v-band DP...

 

[ceedawg]

I have yet to receive my EFR7670, but when I do, it'll be shipped to JMF for a divided T4 manifold and an O2 eliminator 3" v-band DP...

Hmmm interesting. PM'd you.

 

[We're on Boost]

I have yet to receive my EFR7670, but when I do, it'll be shipped to JMF for a divided T4 manifold and an O2 eliminator 3" v-band DP...

Chris, anything happening with your EFR project lately?

 

[Strm Trpr]

Chris, anything happening with your EFR project lately?

Nope, killed the loaner transmission at Infineon last November.

Lined up a pristine 2g Dog Box and was 100% ready to pull the trigger, but the guy I was going to buy it from didn't respond to PM's on Paypal Day due to him being at work away from any PC.

Later that afternoon I received my MRI results, and it turns out I have a tumor dead nuts in the center of my spinal cord between cervical vertabrae C3-C5.

So, I had to tell the guy the bad news, but he said he'd hold it for me until I make a full recovery.

Still waiting on the EFR7670 from Full Race.

I'm in no hurry since my transmission is pulled and I have no replacement.

My engine build has changed yet again and I'm going to rock the following:

2.2L 7-bolt 4G64 internals are:
-94mm Billet Manley Crankshaft
-156mm Pauter Rods
-Custom Assymetrical JE Pistons

Curt Brown Spec 2g head
Curt Brown Spec 2g JMF Drag SMIM
1g N/T TB rebuilt by Steve Monroe at Throttlebodys.Com non half shaft mod.
GSC S2 cams

Eventually a divided T4 JMF exhaust manifold with 3" O2 Eliminator DP and twin recirc'd TiAL 38mm MVS gates.

And of course the Dog Box that will hopefully still be available when I make a full recovery.

Today is my last day at work.

Tomorrow I go in for surgery at UCSF Spine Center and I'll be out for 3 months.
Possibly up to 6 months depending on how the recovery goes.

Wish Me Luck!

 

[96awd]

Nope, killed the loaner transmission at Infineon last November.

Lined up a pristine 2g Dog Box and was 100% ready to pull the trigger, but the guy I was going to buy it from didn't respond to PM's on Paypal Day due to him being at work away from any PC.

Later that afternoon I received my MRI results, and it turns out I have a tumor dead nuts in the center of my spinal cord between cervical vertabrae C3-C5.

So, I had to tell the guy the bad news, but he said he'd hold it for me until I make a full recovery.

Still waiting on the EFR7670 from Full Race.

I'm in no hurry since my transmission is pulled and I have no replacement.

My engine build has changed yet again and I'm going to rock the following:

2.2L 7-bolt 4G64 internals are:
-94mm Billet Manley Crankshaft
-156mm Pauter Rods
-Custom Assymetrical JE Pistons

Curt Brown Spec 2g head
Curt Brown Spec 2g JMF Drag SMIM
1g N/T TB rebuilt by Steve Monroe at Throttlebodys.Com non half shaft mod.
GSC S2 cams

Eventually a divided T4 JMF exhaust manifold with 3" O2 Eliminator DP and twin recirc'd TiAL 38mm MVS gates.

And of course the Dog Box that will hopefully still be available when I make a full recovery.

Today is my last day at work.

Tomorrow I go in for surgery at UCSF Spine Center and I'll be out for 3 months.
Possibly up to 6 months depending on how the recovery goes.

Wish Me Luck!

Crazy setup.

Good luck, sir! Hope you make a quick recovery!

 

[Strm Trpr]

Thank you sir!

Everything should be fine.

I'm very optimistic and my Morale is very high.

People that know me are amazed I'm not freaking out.

I can't, I have to stay positive and motivated to kick this things azz and move on!

I have a World Class Neuro-Surgeon and Brain Surgeon from UCSF working on me that do 150 of these types of operations every year.

That's 1 every other day.

I'll handle this like I Road Race and Ride, WFO ! ! !

Lately I've been getting my adrenalin fix from my other hobby!

1987 Yamaha Banshee Twin Cylinder 350cc 2 Stroke 6spd
I built this beast back in 95'.
I've got well over 50hrs on the motor and she still fires up first kick every time when she's warm.
Pretty much stock except for the .020" Wisecos
Trinity Racing 2 into 1 CNC'd Billet Intake Manifold and 34mm Carb
Duncan Racing Paul Turner Mid-Range Pipes w/Fatboy Silencers
She pulls my buddies Honda 250R which is Bored and Stroked to a 330.
Not too shabby for a more or less stock 24yr old bike.
I have yet to install an adjustable timing plate to advance the timing +4* and V-Force 3 Reed Cages.
Those alone are easily good for another 5whp easy!

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Little bit of Roost!

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Pic was taken a little late, I was already coming down from peak height.

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See how late my buddy was snapping pics.
Nevertheless, this pic did turn out pretty b!tchin.

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The above pics were taken last weekend down at Oceano Dunes SVRA formally known as Pismo Beach.

My favorite place to ride is Sand Mountain, NV shown in the following pic.
4000' Elevation w/500+ vertical feet from base to peak.

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5000 ridable acres.
This place is EPIC!
You see the Super Bowl there in the upper center of the pic below.
Look here! http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=sand+mountain+bowl&aq=f

Check out the 450R riding a wheelie around that beast!

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[We're on Boost]

Wish Me Luck!

Oh man, sounds like you have a busy schedule for awhile!

Lots to look forward to though, when you get out. Maybe you can get doctor's orders to stay home and play with your projects for 3 months before going back to work.

Hmm, Geoff might be a little embarrased about the long wait for that 7670 I would think. Is this the same order that goes back to like December of last year?

I also liked the "Hydroplaning Quad".

Best of luck.

 

[Kapok6]

Anybody running an EFR on a DSM yet?

 

[We're on Boost]

Anybody running an EFR on a DSM yet?

I doubt it. You can kind of get the big picture from post #526 here:

New BW EFR Turbo Thread - Page 36 - evolutionm.net

and there's also info in this thread:

Borg Warner EFR TS 7670; Full Race TS T4 manifold/midpipe/downpipe - evolutionm.net

Wouldn't be surprised if Strm Trpr is riding his Banshee again before these things are really available.

 

[Kapok6]

Anybody put an EFR on yet?

 

[PanZero]

, anyone? Just found out about those turbos and they look awesome. I was looking along the lines of a 6758 with the twinscroll T4...